Q&A: Tribunal Composition, Fellow Detectives’ Concerns and Autopsy Review Failures¶
Day 3 · 8:22:49 · Dean Allison · Cst. Helen Grus · Shawn Buckley · Drew Taylor
- 👨⚖️ Her hearing officer was a single retired Ottawa Police superintendent from her own service.
- 🤝 A fellow SACCA detective first brought the baby-death spike to her; she knows of no hierarchy order telling detectives to stand down.
- 📄 Autopsies occurred but at least one detective closed a case as non-suspicious within 24 hours without reviewing even the preliminary report.
Panel questions on who judged her, shared unit concerns, and incomplete case work.
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Transcript¶
Dean Allison · 8:22:49
In Ontario, your tribunal is made up of whom?
Speaker E · 8:22:55
This—.
Cst. Helen Grus · 8:22:56
My tribunal specifically was a retired superintendent of the Ottawa Police Service.
Dean Allison · 8:23:01
So you had one hearing officer?
Cst. Helen Grus · 8:23:02
One hearing officer and a former member of my own service, yes.
Dean Allison · 8:23:07
So, and when you had the, uh, when you had the conversation with the chief of police early on, who was that chief?
Shawn Buckley · 8:23:17
Was it Still slowly?
Cst. Helen Grus · 8:23:19
That was slowly. And Deputy Chief Ferguson was there as well.
Speaker E · 8:23:22
Yes.
Dean Allison · 8:23:24
Um, so when you were having these concerns, did any other detectives in, in your unit, um, the, the child unit, have a share your concern?
Cst. Helen Grus · 8:23:40
Yes, obviously, because on January— it was about January 10th, there was— it's the officer, actually one of my fellow SACA detectives, that brought this concern up to me. So I was not alone in this.
Speaker D · 8:23:51
Did—.
Dean Allison · 8:23:51
Was there— are you aware of any instructions that went back from the hierarchy within, within Ottawa Police Service that directed those people not to— like those detectives not to pursue those investigations?
Cst. Helen Grus · 8:24:04
I'm not aware of any.
Dean Allison · 8:24:07
You, you said a couple times that you found it very odd that there would be no autopsy autopsy on one of those deaths.
Cst. Helen Grus · 8:24:15
So the autopsy was completed, but the detective never, never reviewed it before concluding it as non-suspicious within 24 hours. And that's just a preliminary autopsy. So autopsies are typically conducted, and they are like— they must be on all SUDI, on sudden unexpected deaths in infants. But again, what's concerning for me is the fact that the officer— the detectives in SACA were not— some of them were not completing these investigations, and, and that was brought up in the tribunal.
Drew Taylor · 8:24:52
Um, do you—.
Dean Allison · 8:24:55
No, I, I want to ask you a question, but I don't want you to answer it if it's going to put you in some jeopardy, uh, for your career, right?
Cst. Helen Grus · 8:25:03
I understand.
Dean Allison · 8:25:04
Uh, so Um, do you have a sense that, like, this is— as Mr. Buckley's indicated, like, I find it very odd that there'd be some pressure to not pursue a wholesome, complete investigation on anything. Um, but are you— did you get a sense that there was some inconvenient truth being covered, or they didn't want the publicity, or, um, you know, or, or what, you know, what would have been the motivation behind, um, you know, the, the conversation of having you basically stand down from, from pursuing something?